The second episode of the Irregular Warfare Podcast, a collaboration between the Modern War Institute and Princeton University’s Empirical Studies of Conflict Project, focuses on counterterrorism. Hosts Nick Lopez and Shawna Sinnott discuss leadership targeting and the use of drones with Dr. Jenna Jordan and Dr. Asfandyar Mir.

Jenna is an associate professor at the Sam Nunn School of International Affairs at Georgia Tech and the director of the Program on Emerging Technology and International Security. She is the author of the book Leadership Decapitation: Strategic Targeting of Terrorist Organizations. Asfandyar is a postdoctoral fellow at the Center for International Security and Cooperation at Stanford University. His most recent research focuses on counterterrorism policy and drone warfare. They both help dig into several complicated questions within counterterrorism studies: How should we be thinking about leadership targeting and counterterrorism effectiveness? What lessons can we draw from leadership targeting in the global war on terror to influence and shape future counterterrorism policies? In line with the charter of the Irregular Warfare Podcast, the conversation bridges the gap between scholars and practitioners by identifying important lessons learned from the study and practice of irregular warfare for both policymakers and practitioners.

Listen to the full conversation below, and be sure to subscribe to the Irregular Warfare Podcast wherever you get your podcasts—Apple PodcastsStitcherSpotifyTuneIn, or your favorite podcast app. You can also follow the podcast on Twitter!


Image credit: Tech. Sgt. Stephen Hudson, US Air Force